[Michael J.]

Hi everyone

After an extended break from running due to foot/lower leg problems, I recently took up running again. I currently have no ambitions to race, my goal is just to be able to run/speed hike in the mountains for fun. During the last few years, I cycled regularly and kept a small amount of fitness. I am now determined to build a big aerobic base. I am doing about 6 days of training per week, alternating running and cycling. I can just cycle indoors at the moment, so overall volume is lower than usual, about 6-8 hours/wk.

As I own a lactate meter (Lactate Pro 2), I am able to test myself regularly. But after reading everything I found on the internet and doing a whole array of tests on myself, I am more confused than ever about where to set my AeT HR.

A normal test for me, on the bike or while running, will give about the following values (5min stages, readings in mmol/l)
Rest: ~1.3-1.5
Stage 1: ~1.3-1.5
Stage 2: ~1.3
Stage 3: ~1.1
Stage 4: ~1.3
Stage 5: ~1.5
Stage 6: ~1.8
Stage 7: ~2.1

Seems easy enough, just stay below the HR after stage 7. However, training at this level (~142bpm on both bike and run, incidentally my “uncorrected” MAF heart rate on the bpm) feels pretty hard. I can’t nosebreath only anymore, get significant HR drift after a relatively short time and don’t feel recovered the next day. My “feel good” intensity is about 10-15bpm lower, incidentally at the point where my lactate readings reach the lowest level of the entire test.

I somehow can’t believe that I am at the point where I have to train in Z1 mostly, since I am clearly aerobically deficient (slow AeT pace >10min/mile, more than 10% spread between AeT and AnT 142/165). I feel I should be able to train much more right below AeT, but it seems to destroy my legs and it makes me tired, moody and gives me bad sleep after just 2 or 3 days.

So why is it that lactate/RPE/breathing differ so significantly? Could it just be a case of too little muscular endurance? Do I just have to suck it up and be tougher, train through the tiredness and sore legs?

With the running, I am seeing at least a little progress from week to week while training in Z1, but progress on the bike is pretty much non-existent at this time…

Topic

[Patrick]

Patrick on June 20, 2020 at 11:01 am #42919

Thanks a lot for your considerations, Scott. Taking them into account, I did an easier session today, finishing at HR just a little above 140 after nearly 2 hours, thus cutting progression in half.

Maybe it could also be a very good idea to measure lactate level every 20-30min to confirm that lactate is not increasing. Here again the lactate measuring device will prove helpful, I guess.

When I slow pace to keep HR constant, am I right to expect falling lactate level?

I got an answer from Swiss Olympic. Unfortunately, there is no English edition of the manual.

[Michael J.]

Michael J. on June 20, 2020 at 12:10 pm #42922

I did measure lactate levels on some longer bike rides, usually may lactate levels stay the sam or even go down a bit regardless of HR up/Power constant or HR constant/Power down, as long as the chosen intensity level is sufficiently low. After about 2.5 hours, lactate and RPE did rise somewhat (0.2-0.3mmol), which at the time was probably the point where my slow twitch fibers were exhausted and some faster twitch fibers had to be cycled in to keep the required power output the same. At least that’s what I was thinking.

[Michael J.]

Michael J. on July 18, 2020 at 12:31 am #43684

I think I owe you an update. Five weeks after restarting my training, I am improving slowly but steadily. My running pace at a HR of 132bpm (top of zone 1, where I still do my MAF tests at) went from 6:58 min/km (11:12 min/mile) to 6:13 (10:00 min/mile) and my average power on the bike went at the same HR went from 181 watts to 199 watts (the numbers are the average of about 3 runs and 3 bike rides per week). I now seem to be moving in the right direction at last!

The things I changed about my training were:
– less frequent running, only about 3 runs per week, and I substitute long, steep hikes in Z1 for running when I have the time for it, sometimes running the less steep downhill parts to keep HR up a bit and toughen up the legs
– less frequency on the bike, only about 3 rides per week, but made these rides longer, at least 90min up to 2.5 hours each session
– no double days, either just bike or just run on any specific day
– at least 1 full rest day per week and an additional 2 unscheduled rest days in 5 weeks when I felt sore, tired and sluggish
– a small amount of zone 2 (HR <142bpm) training, about 40-60min in the middle of a Z1 ride on the bike once a week and only about 20min in the middle of a Z1 run once a week
– do my Z1 training even easier, especially on the bike, where I keep my HR about 5-10 beats under the top of Z1 most of the time
– 2 short strength sessions per week, only about 20-30min each, go easy on the leg exercises

I still look at my training as “transition”, but looking back over the last month, I am very happy with the progress I made. I will keep at it and very slowly increase overall volume and especially Z2 volume as tolerated, without it impacting the subsequent training sessions. I plan to do some lactate testing in about another 4-5 weeks from now if my progress continues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous on July 18, 2020 at 3:46 pm #43691

Super! Good work.

This may be of interest:

How ‘Trainable’ Is VO2 Max Really? – A Case Study